Tuesday, October 24, 2006
Hug your kid again! Wow. What is going on.
I will make this short. The Eureka Reporter - Home Christopher Burgess was a 16 year old boy the system let slip through the cracks. He should have had a chance to enjoy adulthood. I am sure there is more to be heard. The facts are not in. He was just a child. Damn life can be too short. Why is this type stuff happening here? Wasn't that long when the Coopers Gulch incident developed. I do not know the answers, but we need dialogue to find reasoning.
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51 comments:
The EPD is messed up. Force may have been needed, but not deadly force. Even a long scary knife isn't reason enough to do what these thugs did to this kid.
Hug your kids for sure. The cops might shoot them.
I had a bunch of teenagers in my house today (4) 17-19 years old. My son, one of the 19 yr olds reads the paper and thinks independently-asks questions as a rule. We discussed what happened Monday right after we heard about it-I said at the time there is more to this story...
His two younger friends were here today, saw the paper open and said something I didn't agree with-so a discussion ensued.
The gist of my post is this-I use my parental authority and influence to educate not only my kids, but the ones I have access to. I ask them to think, get their news from a variety of sources, ask questions and don't make up their miinds until they have more to go on.
I argued that 3 probation officers aren't usually required to check on kids on probation. I asked them to think of reasons on their own for that to be the case Monday.
I said I'd read that probation officers don't carry weapons, just Mace and that it didn't work when the probation officers used it on the suspect-twice.
I said the paper stated there are other witnesses that have no connection to the suspect or the officers involved.
I asked them to read the articles in both papers and wait for a toxicology test to come back to say whether this 16 yr old, 180 lb kid was on anything at the time.
Something that might have impaired his judgement and caused him to be aggressive with the probation officers-made him run when they asked him to stop.
The parent in me asked them to think about all these things and if they are ever, hopefully never, in a similar situation-I asked them to do whatever the officer tells them to do-STOP! DROP IT! These are not orders to disobey-not because this is a police state or cops are crooked-if you teach your kids that you could be risking their lives!
Be responsible and teach your kids that authority isn't a bad thing-they may respect you more if you care to protect them.
If you corner any animal and do not give them a way of escape, they will turn on you if they feel no way out. Was this young man's crime that grievous to warrant such force? Parole violation? There is so much more we need and will hear.
Well, he ran out of the house agitated, and with a knife. The prior crime wasn't really the issue at that point. The question is whether the police reasonably believed him to be a danger to the public at that moment.
The parent is blaming the authorities for the son's death. The probation officers and police shouldn't have had to blow this kid away, but doesn't the parent have to take some responsibility for all the events that lead up to this? Why are all her kids in foster homes? If these kids had proper parenting, then perhaps this would have never happened at all.
Hard thing to put on a parent. I have seen some of the best raised children being the bad ones and the bad parents getting the best kids. So give the patents a break.
Richard Marks, so in your opinion it's OK for a person to pull a large fixed blade knife on probation officers, flees on foot, threaten to kill a probation officer and the police officer. But it's wrong for a cop to catch up to the criminal and arrest him, wrong if he's cornered ?
I'm a little confused. I was under the impression that cops were supposed to arreste violent criminals.
Eric you smug AH. The prior crime wasn't the issue? Who are you trying to kid. It most certainly was.
"the question is whether the police resonably beleived him to be a danger at that moment"
OK Mr. Lawyer what moment? The moment he faced off to the cop 5-7 feet away in a gully with a 10" fixed blade knife in his hand. Or the moment he ran from the probation officers, stopped to threaten to kill the probation officer (in full view of an elementary school), which MOMENT are you talking about Eric?
Eric, maybe you should contact the grieving mom and offer your legal services? Sue EPD, the cop, the system ....... be a hero to your buddies and make lots of money.
Did you ever take a few seconds to think about the EPD response? The probation officers initiated the contact with Burgess. When they called for help what did they say? Was it on a cell phone or a radio? Was it on EPD radio frequency. What did the officer hear over the radio ? From what the paper says the probation officers called for help saying they were chasing a suspect with a knife and Liles was the, or one of the, responding officers. The cops were responding to a call for help from the probation officers. It doesn't appear that they had time to stop and have a meeting or discussion.
Way to go Eric, you're such a stud.
There's an on-line petition you can sign up on to endorse police review.
It's wrong for the parent to blame ths system if anyone let her child down it was herself, but that gives no reason to shoot the boy in the chest 3 times, come on now all he had was a knife i could see that if he had a gun, but all the officer had to do was shoot him in the leg or next to him, he proably would of shit his pants and drop the knife.
938, it's true that some bad kids come from good parents, but I think that most bad kids come from bad parents.
It wasn't in full view of an elementary scholl and he didn't "threaten to kill" anyone.
For sure he threatened to kill the probation officers, TWICE.
Read the paper before your fingers start typing!
If I said that the person who posted at 12:42 PM was an idiot, that would be rather rude.
Instead, I will say that in the real world, a knife is a deadly weapon. From a distance of only 5 to 7 feet, an assailant with a knife like the one young Mr. Burgess was carrying could kill the police officer in the blink of an eye.
If the police officer held his fire, he would have been trusting his life to an assailant who was taller and heavier than he was, who had just threatened to kill people with that same knife, who had been pepper-sprayed not once, but twice -- WITH NO EFFECT.
Do you know what happens when a normal person is sprayed with pepper spray? It hurts. The eyes slam shut. The throat burns. Many people are so surprised when hit with a blast of pepper spray that they stagger and fall to their knees.
The fact that young Mr. Burgess didn't show any signs of being affected by the pepper spray probably means he was under the influence of some strong stimulant drug.
How willing would YOU be to trust your life to the judgment of a knife-wielding individual under those circumstances?
first of all if you cant use your name and you use anonymous all the time your just a little bitch. a trained police officer should be able to contain a 16yr old child... if he was in a gully the officer could of easily fired a warning shot with no danger. How do you know the pepper spray ever got in his eyes. So did the kid get shot in the chest first or the hip?? since you know erverything, the fact is, Anonymous All you know is what the paper tells you. you really don't know shit besides that, so if you want to call me idiot, meet me outside,
by the way i could blink my eye faster than someone 5 feet away holding a knife and tried to "slit my throat". but if someone was holding a kife i proably wouldn't be blinking.
Go git em Kris! Bitch slapping is highly recommended by our board of Supes!
First Shot thru the Heart, second shot while he was falling down. Read the paper bitch boy....
Kris, you fool.
What is your last name, Kris?
Where do you live?
What is your mother's name?
You don't want to give me that informtion?
Of course you don't.
And I shall remain Anonymous.
A 16 year old "child" that was taller and heavier than the officer.
No child, just a grown up sized juvenlie deliquent, a criminal.
10:56 Kris-If you are so all fired tough that you can handle children on drugs with big knives-I URGE you to enroll in the police academy at College of the Redwoods.
They are cerainly looking for brave guys /gals like you that would be willing to apply at EPD after graduation.
Can I say that I referred you and get the $500 the city used to pay out to entice people to sign up garduate and become police officers here?
The shoot him in the foot or fire warning shots time has elapsed and an officer had to make a split second decision based on his training-if you think that training is inadequate...please not only graduate from the police academy-rise up in the ranks and become an instructor as Terry Liles did (he was a firearms instructor-that was in the paper)
Then perhaps you can find policies that will work better and you can train others how to stay safe on the job and protect the citizens of the community you were hired to Serve and Protect.
Its a tough job sometimes and NOT AT ALL THANKLESS, because there are more of us thanking these guys every time we see a black and white going down our streets-than people like you.
12:58 Keep it civil.
Regardless of how you feel about it, the bottom line is EPD has some major issues, both with day-to-day work and PR. One officer is a known wife beater. Another is reported to have neo-nazi leanings. There is no strong leadership and nobody that knows how to deal with the public properly. I'm not anti-cop. I'm just saying... somebody needs to clean that mess up.
Neo Nazi leanings ? Where do you come off with that shit? I think anybody with a crew cut looks like a Nazi or a gangster , but I don't mean a real Nazi or a real gangster.
What are Neo Nazi leanings ? Listening to Wagner ?
5:40 Put it in writing but you have to use your real name to make a real complaint. Take that to the city council-but do not slander people on the blogs.
You are a cheap shot artist-and to think Humboldt County is proud of their artists! Time for your meds.
Had to work until 7pm tonight. Had to delete some comments. This is a hot button topic. The shooting situation was handled in a manner that will be questioned for some time. I will wait until more information is available.
Kris (last name anonymous) write: "first of all if you cant use your name and you use anonymous all the time your just a little bitch."
My comments: You go by Kris, which is also anonymous. Also, calling me a little bitch, I think, means you are a woman-hating weiner. Oh, yes, your taunts don't touch me at all. Go play with your toys, little boy.
The boy was on meth. The Mom is on meth. I heard through the grapevine that they did meth together. Great parenting. Let's blame the police.
9:45 It isn't part of the topic so back off. We can actually wait to slay the rest of the family during the wrongful death lawsuit that will most assuredly arise from this incident.
We don't need to go on the attack-against either side because the facts will all come out. Take more of a 'wait and see attitude' please.
10:27 gave some good advice.
I wish Margorie Burgess, for one, would take more of a 'wait and see attitude.' I wish she would stop screaming at our elected leaders.
She makes her family look out of control with disrespect for authority.
She thinks she is helping her cause, but she is weakening it.
I think she is whipping up a lot of young people into a frenzy of hatred against the police and local government. I am afraid she may motivate some unstable child to do something dangerous against another police officer, with God only knows what results.
Her grief, anyone can understand. Haven't we all faced grief in our lifetimes? I hope she finds a way to express her grief that will be less likely to incite a riot or a physical attack against someone perceived as an unjust authority figure.
Makes people want to stay home from the special city council meeting.
But if the wait and see types don't go-who is left...which makes this larger than it actually is.
Use your best judgement about go or stay but it would be nice to see some balance in the city council chambers as well as the blogs.
11:06 AM Some very good points.
12:54 PM makes an important point, too. We who want the truth to be known need to show up and make sure the truth is not drowned in a sea of emotion.
1027 you are wrong. Meth is not only part of the topic, it is the main reason that the boy has been in trouble since he was a small child. Get your head out of the sand and wake up. Meth is the biggest prbolem we have in this city right now.
good point 6:09, but I wonder how many "normal" working, non meth using people will show up and expose themselves to the Burgess mob.
Me thinks Ms. Burgess is trying to provoke a confrontation with the police!
I know what you mean when you say you think she is trying to provoke a confrontation with the police.
I have purposely stayed away from these demonstrations because Ms. Burgess and her group seems so impulsive and over-the-top emotionally. I heard her screaming at the DA on TV. Who knows what might happen next?
What happens if they hear something they don't like and decide to fight? It doesn't seem impossible, does it?
I plan to attend the meeting at City Hall Monday at 4pm, and sit in the back of the room.
It really is too important to miss.
8:45am is right. Meth is a huge problem and I hope there was not any in the mix. Ms, Burgess also yelled at Mayor La Vallee. That was not right to do.
Well maybe she was right for yelling at LaVallee. LaVallee was out of line being where he was, doing what he was doing. Maybe some will ask ON THE RECORD what was LaVallee doing with Gallegos when the protest came to courthouse? But I am glad that Gallegos and LaVallee got a up front and personal meeting with Parrent of the Year Margorie Burgess.
In a way I'd like to attend the meeting just to see what BS is put out but there is a good chance that violence will errupt. Burgess and clan want a confrontation with the police and some, if not all of that group, will be smoking meth or drinking all day in anticipation.
It's going to be a zoo and the cages are going to be unlocked. Not a place I want to be.
Well Mr. 12:44pm,
i should go to cr and become a cop, then maby i'll go around shooting people,ha ha. the truth is i never said anything about not liking the police, i said that it was wrong for them to "SHOOT A 16yr OLD KID IN THE HEART 6 FEET AWAY." the only reason the officer was so close to the kid is because he was chasing him, if he would of stop 15 feet away he would have not been so close. Don't get me wrong i'm not sticking up for the mother, People our the way they our because of who raised, or didn't raise them. But to take a person life over runing, wow some of you people have no heart at all.
ps hey bitch boy, you call me a woman hater, how the hell, i Love all woman, tall,short, skinny,fat, brown, white, it don't matter, in fact i was with your wife last nite.
Wow Kris, that was constructive. What kind of stimulants OUR you on?
Part of one writer's post: "But to take a person life over runing [sic], wow some of you people have no heart at all."
-> Are you being thick on purpose? Running was part of a sad and unneccessary drama that Mr. Burgess could have ended at any time by dropping the knife and submitting to lawful authority (the Probation officers or the Police).
Instead, it looks like he held onto the knife and threatened the "cop" with it, too. Bad move!
"No individual is above the Law." If Nixon had remembered that, he might not have had to resign the Presidency in 1974. If Chris had remembered that, he would be alive today.
Didn't the T-S run an article right after the shooting that said
one, the probation officers walked into the house through an open door?
and two, the girl friend said the PO's said "What's up, Chris?"?
and three, that Chris ran away while holding up his pants?
Doesn't all this mean the PO's probably interupted Chris while he and his girl friend were having (oral) sex?
Would that help explain why he was really pissed off?
Why hasn't anybody on the blogs or in the MSM Media asked about this ?
(("What's up, Chris?" Was that a joke about Chris's penis? ))
((And why else would he be holding up his pants? ))
((But how could he hold up his pants AND a knife? ))
It is reall hard not to get judgemental with the limited information we have available. We can only speculate what had happened. The one person who could put the light on this subject is no longer with us. His mother is lashing out, but there might be layers of guilt that again we don't know about. It is a sad commentary of our police departments protocol. Everything about this so far is bad. We can only hope for some lesson for the future or this tragedy is even more sad.
#1 I will never pick on Marjorie Burgess again or stand idle while others do--the woman is in pain.
Remeber that she has a bunch of people around her keeping her stirred up all the time, she never has a chance to grieve her loss--its always on the the next protest...
What I heard in city council chambers is that she had a horrible childhood, didn't know what to do with the kids she gave birth to-asked the city the county for help and now we are here.
That doesn't to me sound like she is totally on the bandwagon with the so called cop haters.
I wanted to give her a hug myself and I am a cop-loving person I suppose who doesn't think plice review is a bad thing.
It worked today at city hall-everyone made their statements in a controlled calm way and listened to each other. There isn't anything wrong with that-lets keep it going.
Mostly watching I felt almost an overwhelming sense of depression...folks seemed like they just couldn't absorb this new incident. I too have had a sense that we as a Community have failed to work towards solutions to a system that is overstressed due to lack of funding, workforce, and the loss of leadership. What is the next step? Can we come together without forcing an "us them" rift that will further weaken our Community. We need ideas, and leadership to pull the Community togehter. Eureka will have to figure this out with it's own citizens. Other towns and cities should leave our Community alone and stop trying to force ideas on our Community that they themselves seem to have a hard time putting into action.
Standing room only, so obviously this was needed to help mend the community. Hopefully some good will come of this meeting.
He should not have run and he should have dropped the knife when he was asked the first 9 times. And his mom should have been a better parent when she had the chance. It is a TRAGEDY for all involved and my heart goes out to all involved on both sides. The cops give fair warning PRIOR to shooting any person. Most cops go their whole career without ever pulling their gun on someone then Lucifer brought Meth to the world of angels. A dead young adult should not be your wake up call. Hugging your child should be a commitment long before they leave the womb.
Sincerly,
A Mother with Teeneagers who are not perfect. But know better than to run from the cops.
THE FIRST COMMENT READ: At 2:55 AM, Anonymous said...
The EPD is messed up. Force may have been needed, but not deadly force. Even a long scary knife isn't reason enough to do what these thugs did to this kid.
Hug your kids for sure. The cops might shoot them.
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NOW THAT WE KNOW "THIS KID" WAS ON METH, maybe what truly loving parents should do is teach their children to obey the law, avoid illegal drugs, and obey lawful orders from the Police.
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